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Comment
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Steve Ducote
Jul 2, 08 - 2:22 PM |
Never Mind the Prizes Can Run for Ribbons Thats OK
But by Oct. what do u think the entry fee will have to be for a hunt to break even!!!!!!!!
Pen Fee. $30
Advertising Hunt 150
Supplies 150
25 Judges exp 7500
Sleeping Qtrs Approx 1200
9,000 dollars No prizes
200 dogs @ 50 dollars 10, 000. just covering expenses
If 150 dogs show up the hunt will loose 1500 dollars and that is giving ribbons for prizes. Hunts will have to do lots of planning, no room for errors
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Mike Bonnette-SFK
Jul 2nd, 2008 - 2:32 PM |
Re: Never Mind the Prizes Can Run for Ribbons Thats OK
Steve, I second that with expenses the way they are this day and time, there is no room for margin of error.
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David Bonner
Jul 2nd, 2008 - 2:33 PM |
Re: Never Mind the Prizes Can Run for Ribbons Thats OK
Steve cut back on the # of judges you have. 20 judges can cover the Jena pen. If you have to, get judges that can travel together.
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Steve Ducote
Jul 2nd, 2008 - 2:37 PM |
Re: Never Mind the Prizes Can Run for Ribbons Thats OK
David that is going to have to happen
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Cherry Dixon Kennels(Chris Patterson)
Jul 2nd, 2008 - 2:41 PM |
Re: Never Mind the Prizes Can Run for Ribbons Thats OK
Take all hunters that can walk and see,put them in groups of three to judge.Hire a master of hounds to keep them straight $500.00 and a computer operator $300.00 this will leave $7,900.00 more to top ten.
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Steve Ducote
Jul 2nd, 2008 - 2:47 PM |
Re: Never Mind the Prizes Can Run for Ribbons Thats OK
Chris in theory that is a good thought, in reality it doesn't work. You want the best competitors from across the country to show up at Major hunts You have to have real judges and they can't be all local judges. Top competitors go where the best judges go, has always been like that
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Cherry Dixon Kennels(Chris Patterson)
Jul 2nd, 2008 - 3:03 PM |
Re: Never Mind the Prizes Can Run for Ribbons Thats OK
If they are real hunters,they should be great judges.We run alot of one day hunts this way and it seems to work well.All three have to agree on all crossings or you throw it out.Any disagreements you radio the Master to come straighten it out.I know that most field trials will never go for this but I would like to see a few.You could lower the entry fee and still take home more money.If you have 100 people or hunters show up,maybe 10 are not physically able to judge.This still leaves 30 sets of judges in the field and a big home plate group. Chris
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Lenny Crowe Dog Bluff knls
Jul 2nd, 2008 - 3:28 PM |
Re: Never Mind the Prizes Can Run for Ribbons Thats OK
We need to have less hunts there for we could have higher entries when we have a hunt there for enabling the associations to earn enough to pay all expenses give good prizes and treat our judges well.
This would relive the judges from having to constantly traveling every weekend to a hunt.
This would bring together more competition to make better field trials....
There are way way more hunts than there used to be that is the reason the entries have gotten lower and lower....example around here there was only pamplico, then came manning and the entries at pamplico got smaller, then came old 74 entries got smaller at manning and pamplico...this is one example, there is 2- 3 day hunts this weekend within 80 miles of my house.
Lenny
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Bluff-Springs-TYE
Jul 2nd, 2008 - 4:01 PM |
Re: Never Mind the Prizes Can Run for Ribbons Thats OK
There will allways be controversey when hunters judge their own hounds....TYE
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Heath Howell
Jul 2nd, 2008 - 4:24 PM |
Re: Never Mind the Prizes Can Run for Ribbons Thats OK
We may have to try the hunters judging option at the smaller hunts. I thought about seeing if the Hunters Horn would create a seperate designation for this kind of hunt and have it noted on the pedigrees. I was going to call it a Kennel Club Trial. Have the participants sign a sportsmanship agreement and at the end of the trial if any of the participants felt like there was dishonesty then the results wouldn't count for anything. You couldn't do this at a Major event but it might work at a county hunt. It would be better than no hunt at all.
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bubba sharpe
Jul 2nd, 2008 - 4:30 PM |
Re: Never Mind the Prizes Can Run for Ribbons Thats OK
heath, every hunt somebody disagrees w/ the outcome, kinda like crowe said just way too many hunts, just yesterday a new hunt was "born", everyone wants to put on a hunt I guess. it's no way the hunters or the judges can turn out as hoped because of logistics
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Heath Howell
Jul 2nd, 2008 - 4:36 PM |
Re: Never Mind the Prizes Can Run for Ribbons Thats OK
There is a difference between having a hunter disagree with the outcome and having him protest because he thinks someone cheated. Fewer hunts would help for sure but if the entries have to get too high to pay the expenses you start having a problem with keeping the game in the pen.
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Cherry Dixon Kennels(Chris Patterson)
Jul 2nd, 2008 - 4:53 PM |
Re: Never Mind the Prizes Can Run for Ribbons Thats OK
Surely,out of every three you put together there would be one honest person to keep the other two straight.
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JohnnyBeal/Crazy8Kennel
Jul 2nd, 2008 - 5:35 PM |
Re: Never Mind the Prizes Can Run for Ribbons Thats OK
Surely ya'll don't think there are that many crooked hunters out there. I personally don't like judging hunts my dogs are in. But I would rather judge then not have enough judges. Around here we pretty much know who will call it straight and who want. That is the reason you pair up like Chris said. Which there again this is one day hunts with mostly local hunters. You are going to always have somebody griping and complaining. I don't care what you do. But I don't see why it want work. As long as you pair up to judge and don't pair up running buddies.
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Bluff-Springs-TYE
Jul 2nd, 2008 - 8:46 PM |
Re: Never Mind the Prizes Can Run for Ribbons Thats OK
Well try you a few 2 and three day hunts and see how it works, I personaly will not attend a huntfor 2 or 3 days that hunters judge cause,some folks just cant help it....TYE
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JohnnyBeal/Crazy8Kennel
Jul 2nd, 2008 - 9:16 PM |
Re: Never Mind the Prizes Can Run for Ribbons Thats OK
Thats the ones I don't even want at a hunt I'm going to. If folks would tell them not to come instead of worrying about getting there entry fee this great sport would be better off. My job won't allow me to two or three day or believe me I would. Not trying to be smart or anything but alot of times pen owners and hunters alike know who will DO ANYTHING IT TAKES TO GET THERE NAMED CALLED AND LET THEM COME ANYWAY.
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Johnny Bratton
Jul 2nd, 2008 - 9:30 PM |
Re: Never Mind the Prizes Can Run for Ribbons Thats OK
You have to have an auction to survive, can make up to 2000.00 on donated items. Been doing this since the 70's it will off set expenses. Got to get the board to help gather up items. I serve on 3 boards, and now President of the CFA, it's work. You can have one day hunts to help sponser your 3 day hunts.
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DEREK DUPRE Mid South Kennels
Jul 3rd, 2008 - 2:59 PM |
Re: Never Mind the Prizes Can Run for Ribbons Thats OK
I have never seen judges expenses at 7500 in a "local" hunt nor the need for 25 judges, all of the pens that we have here in Ark that have hunts have a place to house most of the judges, that negates that expense also. I think that in all of the years I was secretary of the Central Ark we never got over 2000 for judges expenses and meals. Would have to go back and check the reports to be sure. I think that 12-15 able judges are good enough for the 500-600 acre pens that we have here in Ark. And a lot of the local judges turn in little to no expense. I might see the money that u are talking about in a major hunt but then a lot of them have either 100.00 entry fees or large turnouts , or both historically. I got to win , and a ribbon will be fine for me . I would be willing to bet there will be a calcutta floating around at most hunts also if u look hard enough.
DEREK DUPRE
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JAMES
Jul 3rd, 2008 - 4:17 PM |
Re: Never Mind the Prizes Can Run for Ribbons Thats OK
HEATH THAT THIRTY DOLLAR ENTRY FEE SHOULD REPLACE THE GAME THAT IS CAUGHT, 200 HOUNDS X $30 = $6OOO that will buy alot of game and have some money left.
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Heath Howell
Jul 3rd, 2008 - 4:52 PM |
Re: Never Mind the Prizes Can Run for Ribbons Thats OK
Are you familiar with the little Operation that the USFWS and nine state wildlife departments suprised us with last year? They saw hundreds of game animals being stocked in a single pen in one year and they started scratching their heads.
Having a hunt that requires the pen to be restocked is not an option we can afford in the future. Loss of game must be minimized, not accounted for in the entry fees.
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Heath Howell
Jul 3rd, 2008 - 5:07 PM |
Re: Never Mind the Prizes Can Run for Ribbons Thats OK
75 hounds is about all you can get at an Open hunt in South Alabama. At $75 entry fee that gives you $5625. Take away $2250 for pen fees and now you have $3375 to pay 12 judges travel expenses at $4.00 per gallon and they are all driving trucks that get about 14 miles to the gallon. I would be ashamed to not give even the local judges enough money to cover their expenses. If you can get by with $1000 worth of gas that leaves you $2375. Now, you have to feed the judges. There goes another $800 which leaves us with $1575. If you had to pay for hotel rooms, which we do around here that will take you down close to $1000 left to pay the top 10 hounds. And that is just about the way it works out around here.
Now, if the Kennel Club hunt would work I would set the entry fee at $40 to pay the pen fees and have a big supper one night. No money would be paid back. This kind of thing would be for foxhunters, not gamblers. You remember foxhunters don't you? There the ones that actually care about the hounds.
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JAMES
Jul 3rd, 2008 - 7:13 PM |
Re: Never Mind the Prizes Can Run for Ribbons Thats OK
SOME PENS DON,T CHARGE AS MUCH AS WHAT YOU ALL CHARGE, MOST PENS IN MY AREA CHARGE TWENTY FOR AA AND 15 DERBY FOR THREE DAY LOCAL COUNTY HUNTS AND ARE A LOT BIGGER PEN, LOADED WITH GAME.
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JAMES
Jul 3rd, 2008 - 7:17 PM |
Re: Never Mind the Prizes Can Run for Ribbons Thats OK
I FORGOT TO SAY THAT MOST ENTRY FEES ARE 40 TO 50 DOLLARS WITH PRETTY GOOOOOOD PAY BACK.
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