What did the deer do to foxhunting? Not many left that know or care I guess.

What did Tennesee Lead do for thé foxhound?

I have been around this old world for a long time and you Can't beat a good fox race! But! When my hounds can put food on my table and run a fox just as good I have no complaints when they get on a deer an ole nanny doe race is just fine with me as long as my hounds are running it right. Because when its season and my freezer fills up I'm just as proud...

Fact: The deer are here to stay

Fact: The modern day foxhound is not a leaf turning, grey fox hound that hunts on the outside

Fact: The modern day foxhound is a heads up, coyote hound that runs the majority of its life in an enclosure.

If we were around 50 years ago, sure we would of all had the dogs of yesteryear that you miss so dearly but we weren't and this is how hounds are run today and to be perfectly honest with you, I enjoy it just like it is inside the pen and on the outside. I don't want to boo who and trail a fox on the outside, if I am running on the outside I will have an orange hat and shotgun with me and my dogs better be smoking a big doe. In a pen there is no need for the leaf turners that you miss so dearly, they better be heads up and fast to make it in this day and age. Don't like that? get some tri-tronics and take to the outside and break them off deer and run your grey fox that no one cares about or knows about anymore. Times change Old Timer, some for the best and some for the worst. Keep up or get left behind!

Young gun ,your a deer hunter who goes to the pen to keep the fat off his deer dogs till deer season. You probly never been around foxhunters. thats not your fault. I was posting to see if any foxhunters left as the site says masterfox.I was 55 years old before i saw a deer. I never shot at one nor ate any. I wish they go away.They ruined the only true sport ever known to man. I knew when i posted it be deer hunters pop out the woodwork on a fox hunting site.I like read fox on here thats all. good night.

I love the internet and masterfox but one of its biggest down fall would be is how easy it is to spread ignorance around the world. Fact is if you weren't around back when they had good red fox running on the outside, you don't know the first thing about a good fast dog and your post is proof of it

You're correct, I wasn't around then. I cant help I wasn't hunting 70 years ago with you old timer. If you don't like the way us young whiper snappers hunt again....get some tri tronics and go to the outside and break your dogs and run fox. But wait, tri tronics weren't around then so you probably don't want to use those either. I never claimed to know what a good fast dog was, but I enjoying the running and the hounds we have today.

Looks like, based on your sentence structure and punctuation that you are the one spreading the ignorance; Fact is.

Give me a break YOUNG GUN the man was just stating facts deer have ruined fox hunting i love to hear a pack of hounds run a fox on the outside but because of deer and no place left to hunt i mostly hunt in pens and dogs arent as good as they used to be and based on your last lil statement you truly showed your ignorance just my opinion!!!!!!

I am one of the old timers THE ONLY THING SEE FROM YOUR POST YOUNGGUN THAT YOUR PARENTS DID NOT TO TEACH YOU TO RESPECT YOUR ELDERS

The hounds are still bred to run game! Whether that be deer fox coyotes or rabbits... its the choice of the hunter as to what his hounds do! I have put many red fox through these hardwoods around my house and in these same woods killed deer in front of the same hounds and love it nothing has happened to the fox hunters there are just more hunters out there now that choose to run deer and there is nothing wrong with that. Their hounds their choice

I've run more game in enclosures than you will ever get the chance to run.I don't give a rats butt about what you you guns do or even call foxhunting.I see what I'm up against here so I'm done with this.Kinda like spurring a dead horse

With the amount of coyotes that are in the area I hunt we very seldom run a fox. Are there still some straight fox dogs around that won't run a coyote or a deer?

The Main problem I see on here weather be old young new born or ancient be a MAN and use your names why hide behind a fake name on such a post I grew up listening to my grandpas and uncles talk about the old outside hunting and to be honest I'd a loved to been able to enjoy that day and time but I didn't now I still like a hound that has just plain fox or coyote sense one that can flat azz run a piece of game with plenty gear with that being said each man for his own and guys come on let's not bicker amongst each other god bless and happy hunting .

travis, I hunted at joe branch before there was ever a pen. we foxhunted and deer hunted all over those woods from hwy. 16 to lee rd. we had very few deer at that time. I enjoyed a good fox race and every once in a while a deer race. that change quickly over a 5-10 year period and all the outside land was lease up. then we went to the pens. I enjoy all of both worlds because I like to hear a hound. maybe the hounds are not as good as outside hounds, but it is the way we have to train them. my advice is to enjoy it and take it all in because we might not have it for many more years.

I hate it for the OLD TIMERS who loved the all night fox races, I had a few myself. The deer population has made it a lot harder. I hate it for the YOUNG HUNTERS who never heard a all night 15 dog pack rolling on of those red fox. I was lucky enough to run red fox,grey fox and coyotes on the outside for about 15 years with the same hounds I deer hunted with, and ran in pens. I just wish US hunters could agree to disagree and support each other at what ever way they wish to hunt. That would make our sport a lot stronger. And this day in time with all the anti's against us is what we need. So HAPPY HUNTING, and lets get together and make our SPORT BETTER. And I agree with Travis, post your name, or don't comment.

outside foxhunting is far from over in eastern north carolina.we battle all the obsticles mentioned and then some.fact is a lot of foxhunters that we're refering to dont get on the internet..or care about a field trial anymore.i think some of the greatest hounds ever are living today and with the technology used today,handling and breaking hounds of faults today is easier than its ever been.

most foxhunters will enjoy their hounds and a foxrace over competition...and most that strive to keep thiers off deer realize they've took the 'field trial type competative edge'of thier hounds when they break them...and dont want to subject a good 'game' hound to uncontroled off game running...some concider coyotes off game as well as deer.

i've been fortunate enough to judge a lot of outside trials,and seen some mighty good hounds..so i'm not knocking any outside hunts.

but..the outside hunters that keep true broke hounds didnt have a hunt to go to that they were confident no deer running would take place..so i restarted the deerproof hunts that oscar long and mr lewis oliver created...we have a spring hunt and a fall hunt,we're selective on who gets numbers to prevent deer running,we scratch and crate hounds running deer...most hunts have cast from around 80 hounds to 200...and after 8 hunts i dont think we've had over 10 scratched for running deer at any hunt...some probally slipped through like at any hunt...but the majority is deerproof...and when you back up to the woods and freecast this many hounds you'll find out real quick !

i'm not trying to start an arguement over deerrunning..but anyone interested in the tpye hunt i described and keep deerproof hounds is welcome to call me if you'd like to come to a hunt.
we all hunt diffrent..and we must cull and judge our hounds the way we hunt them..good hunting to all.alvin barrow 252-217-7837

We do take our running situations as they evolve. One thing is for sure. As Kermie spoke of for those who have never run a red on the outside, I wish you only had the experience. It was that good.

Mr McSwain to answer your question yes there is I own 3 that want run a coyote but it is harder to brake them off of coyote then it is deer. I also no several fox and cat hunter that own quit a few hounds that r strait fox and cat hounds.
Also to the young hunter u need to come listen to these leaf flippers the only problem with these leaf flippers of today is that gray fox or cat can't stay on the ground to long

whether we be pen hunters or outside we are one greatest people on earth foxhunters who is always there to help each other I hope when the good LORD calls me home he tells me get over here get by this fire and listen to these hounds the best music in the world

Guys i started fox hunting at 10 years of age i am now 44 i have good friends that are old and i have young ones too. Fox hunting has changed so much but 1 thing has not changed for me i love to hear a pack of hounds really ball up on something and run it. And i sure miss some of the older men that got me started hunting i loved the stories and fellowship but 1 thing is certain most fox hunters young and old are good FOLKS they are like a second family to me and i love them and the sport DEARLY GOD BLESS and happy hunting!!!S.R.

YOUNG GUN I HAVE READ YOUR POST SEVERAL TIMES UNTIL IT FINALLY HIT A NERVE......FACT MODERN DAY FOX HOUNDS ARE NOT LEAF FLIPERS THAT RUN ON THE OUTSIDE.....FACT MODERN DAY FOXHOUNDS ARE RUN MOST OF THEIR LIVES ONLY IN A PEN........WOW....I GUESS I MUST HAVE SPENT THE LAST 40 YEARS OF MY LIFE DOING EVERYTHING WRONG......SOOOOOO WHY DONT YOU LOAD YOUR YOUNG ASS UP COME TO SOUTHERN MO AND WE WILL RUN ON THE OUTSIDE AND IN THE PEN UNTIL ONE OF US CANT TAKE IT ANY MORE......MAYBE JUST MAYBE YOU CAN TEACH ME SOMETHING....I HOPE YOUR PEN HOUNDS HOME PRETTY GOOD OR YOU WILL SPEND A WEEK LOOKING FOR THEM...CHARLIE WALKER....573-858-3339......

Hunters and Pens has changed foxhunting....not deer. Deer is the least of my worries..... traps and coyotes eliminating grey fox quicker than the distemper is the main problem around here.... fox trax are scace as deer trax were in the 70's.... Deer didn't cause it!!!

well im only 46 but I remember hunting in 1973 before we had many deer or coyotes I have been hunting eversince I don't belive the deer hurt hunting as much as the still hunters did .. I now hunt 95% on the outside and 7 of the 9 hounds I run are deer proof ... I mostly run coyotes with the occasional fox race ..most of the fox in my area have moved too town and I havnt seen a gray fox in Illinois in 15 years so coyotes it is and most of the races last from 3 to 12 hours depending on the conditions back in the mid 70s we had no tracking equip other than the ear and we had all night fox races on the outside never had to move the truck as for what I strive for now is a good track dog not leaf flipper or a speed demon just a hound that can stay up on a track and get it across a paved road cause that's what we got up here as far as deer go its illegal to knowingly chase them in Illinois so I loosly use 3 strikes your out for my hounds..thats just my 2 cents not pointed anyway just what im doin rite now..suits me fine ..but good ole redfox runnin in the 70s sure was better on gas

I known 1 thing there r two fellow in south ga that's got real fox & cat hounds
Have not hunting on outside wear I live in thirty years i go with them when I can but a outside race is hands down by far better then a pen race there nothing better then a pack that is hock up it get the blood flowing thanks to my friends I still can enjoy some of my youth and manures of a great time

lol I know that seems kinda young to be huntin but id been given my own dog by then, was chewin plug tobacco,drinkin coffeeand playin in the fire was drivin by the time I was 8 and it for sure was I different world then

I am an outside hunter, years ago hunted in the pen a little did pretty good won several field trials! but here is what I saw, different strokes for different folks some likes it, some don't, personally I don't care for it but its what some have to do to enjoy a hound race, I have all broke dogs, right now I have 11 that are 100% broke will not run anything but a grey fox or a bobcat, I know what it takes to break a hound and I know when he is wrong all the time, a man that says he don't have problems is not hunting, a dog is a dog they will make a liar out of you very quick, leaf flippers I like that , but here is something else I know!!! if you have a car without a starter and you have to push it off everytime what good is it? have to park it on a hill everytime to crank it that aint no good, I have 11 so called leaf flippers, I figure there not leaf flippers there vacuum cleaners, cause there doing some kind of sucking thru there nose smelling a track, and if one did not have them on the outside half the time you would go home without hearing anything, cause unlike the pen there isn't a fox hiding behind every bush, or 20 in 50 acres, I have broke dogs with a hot collar and without 1 its all about knowing how ! and knowing dogs, everything I have is a reg hound thru the chase no tree dogs running dogs, and I hunt probably a lot more than a lot, 3 sometimes 4 nights a week, I could care less about a deer , deer don't bother me when hunting, back thru the summer broke 5 at one time, theywould turn a deer out of a fox race, but I bet they wont now, and there off some stuff a lot run inside the wire, but they lack a little nose, could have more but they will come, I have hounds that ride ontop the box and have struck 100 yards off the road no lie ! have them that will rear up in the road trying to get where the sent is and strike him and run him there is no leafs in the sky, one day young gun you might figure out what a true foxhound is ! but there is something you going to have to do first get out of the pen if you can !! do what one likes , the main thing we all need to stick together, cause there gunning for all of us

Glad you can still enjoy an outside race.In the state of Tn. you would get your hounds shot by deer hunters. It would be trouble every time you cast.And the law will be in with the deer hunters. No help from law at all! The deer ended it here as the old guys like myself die out and no youth able to carry on.They all deer and turkey hunt or watch tv all night.But that said with a fair size pen with a few coyotes and fox,my huntin with hounds goes on.Not the same as a wide swinging red fox race that last 9 or 10 hour but better than nothin. And it never was "fact" that Tennessee leed was after a deer. We all hav read the same" tales ".But seems he did help run the red in Ky.

Mr Mcfann well said,i enjoyed your post..where are you located

One thing for sure , Young Gun didn't have a strap put on him enough growing up. He definitely never heard a good outside fox race. It's a sign of the times I suppose. I'm lucky enough to have a good place to run my hounds on the outside on fox and in a pen on coyotes. To each their own. Young Gun was right about 1 thing. Deer eat a lot better than a fox or coyote. They are fun to run too.

would you rather fish in a lake or in a foot tub cause that is the difference between having a jam up fox race on the outside and one in the pen and yes i know different circumstances has made most hunters have to hunt in a pen i've did plenty of both types of hunting and had alot of races on the outside on fox that was as fast or faster as any ever heard in a pen so you young whipper snappers if your have never heard a race on the outside like that don't knock it not all outside dogs are leave flippers you take a dog trained in a pen to the outside and you have a road runner

It's about time some REAL GUNS started speaking up to these little cap pistols haha

The young whipper snapper needs a Big Jake lesson - "son, since you don't have any respect for your elders, it's time somebody taught you some respect for your betters! "

Mr Barrow I am in south GA , about 45 mins south of savannah, in a little town called ludowici GA

I'm not that old and don't know half as much as most but I've hunted inside and outside the wire. Hunted alot with Brian on the outside. What getts me is most pen hunter think just bc a hound can smell an can trail he don't have any speed. Well I've seen noise is speed inside or out. You take a fast wide running pen dog on the outside and 99 percent can't get in a race. They will get to cutting there self out of the race. .I've seen Brian holler those so called leave blower off grey fox BC if he hadn't he was fixing to die . I'v e seen dogs that have won many sd hunts come on they outside in a heated fox race an still the race from a pack a good track running hound an run it about 50 yards an that s it,race over

Brian Mcfann,

Could I call you sometime, to get a few pointers about deer breaking. I have been trying to cat hunt on the outside for a few years, have a few young dogs and one about three that will still turn a deer out of a cat race.

yea call me anytime, im no expert but I have a proven way of breaking them , aint real hard one can almost do it in the pen at home, I say about 95 % broke in the pen if one wants to do it that way 912 977 5509

I wish i could buy the method in book form. Any chance of it ever being used for the public? I hav tried for years to run around the deer with little success.Tried to breed it out but bred the hound out.This sounds great at 95%.As there are 95 deer to every fox here were hunt and a hound will hav to hunt to find one.

deer hunters killed my 13 year old boys foxhound gyp run n a coyote around christmas. I am finnished with it. They want the woods to them selvs.they can hav it.Yal deer hunter hav a nice day!