Why does some get so uptight about scratching hounds at hunts or pups at puppy hunts even.Thought we are trying to improve just asking?

The biggest reason I can think of it's easy for someone to cheat you if they see your dogs doing good they can just scratch them.

Couldn't they just as easily add scores?

If u don't trust a judge to scratch your hound you shouldn't trust them scoring everybody else's hounds.

In my opinion, the reason most puppy hunts don't scratch dogs is due to the fact of the people hosting the hunts do not want to scare off hunters. I say scratch them. But most puppy hunters will not go to a hunt if they can get scratched for babbling, loafing, etc.

To many worried about hurting feelings instead of bettering hounds seen to many at gates guys wouldn't go pick up and too many running babbling their heads off chasing dogs if judges would be harder on dogs wouldn't be so many on the culling block and be better breeding programs

Right on old school

I judge quite a few hunts . Not as many as I used to because of work and I still like to enter a huntor two. People y'all have got to quit thinking your getting cheated if your dog gets scatched!! Don't take it so dang personal!? Yes I know you work and put your heart and soul in your Lil units!! But the pressure of big packs On a good dog I have seen do things you would not believe! Like one of the post above says if you don't trust a judge to scratch a dog for a fault why in the world would you trust him to score one??? I know some real great judges that are getting tired of it too!! Now for scratching at puppy hunts unless a pup quits ,I say up to the age of ten months and less the babbling aka happy barking I could turn my head but when a pup starts getting 11 months to early derby age he should be grown out of it like I have seen many do!! I would rather them stop by 8 months but that's me!! But if I'm judging what the master of hounds asks of the judges on scratch is not a problem as long as everyone is judging the same way!! Just my humble opinion!! God bless and happy Hunting and running 👍👍👍

I say you take the same hound home that you brought to the hunt. what has changed ?

Good read spanky but I must say I hate a babbler period and yes some pups will stop but not many they usually get worse.What bothers me more is when people won't scratch the babbler and the quitter.Happy hunting to all.

Me too.

Scratching dogs not gonna help improve,look at what we score them for,get the front no matter what,don't have to bark a lick,give them anything you want.

Agree and disagree. If culls are culled for faults and the road runners aren't scored you'll see an improvement in hounds.

I say scratch em if they need it

In my opinion, it don't do much good to , just scratch a dog in a feild trial . If the dog or puppy is babbling bad enough to interfere with the race , he should be scratched and crated by the judge or owner . Just scratching the dog on paper has not eliminated the problem . If he quits and lays down , he should be scratched and loaded .
If he's just loafing around and not running, he's not scoring any points , if he's running the roads and swinging, he ain't scoring many points.

It's been my experience that most people are not gonna cull their dog for getting scratched .

Culling needs to be done at home , if a man brings a dog to hunt , he probably likes him well enough that he's not gonna take another mans opinion to heart .

The only way we are gonna really improve the breed , is to cull close and cull at home .

I agree the scratching should be done at home, If more hunters would judge they would see things at a hunt that apparently don't see at other times

They have been scratching dogs for years for laying down. But in my opinion there is nothing worse than a road running dog that cuts in front of a dog running the games and runs it about a hundred yards or to the next road and throws it away or just runs down the road to cut in front of another race and messing that race up. NOW WHICH ONE OF THESE DOGS MESSES THE RACE UP THE WORSE? NOT THE ONE LAYING DOWN!!!!

older hunters had bigger bone piles. Today's hunters have fatter wallets

Well most pen owners have a hard time finding judges the start with and so many hunts going on and a lot of young people and some older ones now judging they don't even have a clue what a good dog is let alone judge one then like some of the others said up here,,it is true .But some of the older Eastern Nc judges back in the day
if they where judging a hunt a the scratch sheet could look like somebody had there throat cut with all the red lines and would bring the dogs up there and put the dogs in the holding pen for you to look at while the rest of the hunt was still going on a dog would not run up and down and stand in the road stealing races ,,it would make you think twice before the next one but **** most of the dogs now are brain dead before 2 years you have small pens loaded down with game most of them could not run a coyote out of a tent but that's field trailing now days it is what it is,,we made it that way

Alan you are exactly right good post.

Thanks!! I wanted to say more it's no use people will do like they want to but there just fooling there selves

That's right but it's still good to know someone knows a good hound but they will also say they don't have time that's why their dogs are like they are now.

You might be surprised at what you can do with a scratched dog . I got one from a fellow that has satisfied me reall well. On the first hunt in the outside woods he was lost, didn't know what to do.. He was fast but over run every track by a long ways. He would just keep swinging with his head up hunting another patch of scent to bark on. Put him with some dogs that could run game pretty good on the outside and he did the same thing for a few trips. when he swung out the wrong way he was was wasting a lot of time and energy getting back in the race. Because they were wearing him out from behind and he was scrambling to get some of it.
After about 10 trips outside he started putting his nose down and slowed down and started picking up checks in the pack. He is still by far the fastest dog in the pack when conditions are right but he has learned conditions are not always right and sometimes he has to slow down and use the nose. Saw him cold trail a red fox for about half hour in the late part of the morning after the dew was gone and jumped it. he learned what his nose is far. Not all swinging cutting pen dogs are worthless on the outside, it just running in a pen loaded with game creates a total different environment.

I agree with you James !! The outside is the best place for a young hound unfortunately around these parts it almost a lost sport because of land owners!!you know it's kinda funny as I sit here and read all those that field trial most are for scratching a dog if it needs it until it's one of his/hers that gets that dreaded red line!! Then all of a sudden a judge cheated him!! some one said or asked what fault is worse cutting and swinging and babbling or if they quit!! Well every fault is bad!! I hate with a passion a babbling lying dog!! Or one that runs other dog tracks!! I watched one this weekend run a dog up one road turn the corner and run him out of site down another yep I scratched it !! With the rules you had to have two judges see it to officially scratch him and well it made the hunt! !! People want others dogs scratched just not theirs!! And I agree hounds should be culled at home first most need to take their kennel goggles off get there heart out of the dog pens!! !! We need to get harder on our hounds at home and in field trials!!! God bless and happy hunting and running!!

All those bad traits that have been discussed on this topic are really annoying to the spectators but they don't really interfere with a good pack of hounds that know how to take care of business. I've noticed that a good dog recognizes what's going on pretty quick and want pay attention to a bad hound for long. If someone continues to bring bad hands to trials, he needs to be scratched but that would lower the win money.

James, you're ok with a babbler or quitter winning a hunt?

If you have judges that will score a babbler or one that quits, you need to scratch those judges. I don't know how the rules are set up but if a dog like that can win there should be some rule revision. A dog that quits can't win anything. If it was running high scoring hound but quit for any reason before the hunt ended , he is out I would hope the rules are that way. If the second high hound finishes the hunt, it wins. As far as babbling, iv had a few young dogs that would run behind a dog barking when you first turn out but settled down after they stopped and cleaned out. Never had a dog that was a steady babbler. Had some dog that had more mouth than most people liked but they contributed as much as the others in the race. After dogs have ran with a mouthy dog they recognize when he is searious and when he is just hoping. If you listen close you can tell too. Some mouthy dogs can add a lot to a pack. I've never owned a dog that was a continuous babbler without smelling something. I think I would let someone that liked babblers have him.

There are rules in place, but this topic is about hunts that chose to not scratch for faults.

hunts must not be governed or sanctioned by strict organizations. Didn't know a hunt had that option to change rules.

James don't understand your last post.Call the chase get a rule book read it.As for you saying a quiter never wins I witnessed and got beat by a hound that laid up by a back gate where there were multiple Hunters for 3 hours.Judge rode by him 3 times.I was almost sure he got red line but guess what he didnt.The owner of the hound wouldn't even buy him in a 5 dollar Calcutta.How he won I don't know but he did.I placed 6th but this hound never deserved a champion title.Not bad mouthing judges but if you ride by a hound 3 times in 3 hours he/she needs red line period.

this conversation is a little confusing for somebody like me that just goes out and runs dogs. Let me out of here and I'll go run something.

Happy hunting

Know what your feeding. A sorry dogs eats just as much as a good dog. If you cant get out of your truck to watch your dogs then your at the Mercer of the field trials to tell you what your feeding. A dog gets scratch for a reason. Puppy hunts and the Derby class are for this reason. All Age dogs at a field Trial are expected to be top notch and the judge is looking for a champion. It is what it is. Know your dogs feed them well and run them into shape. Field Trials are competition events against the best in the business. Know what your feeding. Cast your Hounds.

I agree

The purpose of a field trial is supposed to be to determine a Champion.
A hound should be scratched for any fault observed which would mar the characteristics of an ideal field champion.
We all need to remember the your best hound is still just a dog, they all do some stupid things sometimes even when they know better, kind of like people.

If you've got honest qualified judges dogs don't get scratched, they scratch themselves.

bring back scratching for CUNNING RUNNING. most may not be old enough to remember this rule but it would solve alot of problems from hunters bringing road running no game running race flanking hounds to hunts. not counting on helping the future of breeding nose back and getting back to some foxhounds worth feeding. ive judged a many big hunt and these type hounds are easiest to pick in the field. plus will benefit pen owners saving game since most is caught in road not from behind